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Ca18de - det

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hi,

 

curious, can i bolt on a turbo to my current ca18de?

 

or do i have to buy the whole thing (ca18det) new engine??

 

thanks

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do a search :rolleyes:

 

yes and no, lots of things to do if you want to turbo a DE motor, so i'd say no coz it's easier/cheaper to buy a DET.

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Yeah I'd suggest just buying a CADET instead. Although if your budget is fairly limited and you only want to run a little bit of boost you could probably do it. Just remember you don't just slap a turbo on. You have to have things like new manifold, new dump pipe, intercooler and piping plus the turbo. And that's the bare minimum. Maybe try and find some wreckers with a ca18det that you can just rip the standard parts off. Although I can't be 100% sure that it'll all fit as I've never done this before.

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save us, and yourself the time. just go buy a DET engine, or stick with the de, because it will cost you just as much to make ur de a de+T

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Hey i have a DET which i wanna hold off on rebuilding for now but i also got two DE's... If i Use my DET Exhaust manifold, Stock t25, Stock S13 cooler, perhaps DET injectors can i bolt it on and drive it till she blows... should i look at lowering compression or will it be ok at standard boost...?

 

I picked a complete DE engine up for $100 yesturday and plan to put it in till i finish rebuilding the Other DE

 

Before everyone says Use the DET that is being saved for my 1600 so i was only gonna use a DE for a daily driver in the bluebird... but after driving my mates 180Bsss with carby-fed L20 Turbo i wanna boost this too

 

Please let me know what parts i should use cause i can take DET parts if i need to...

 

Can the one thats goin in be used with a decompression plate or something and when i build the other DE i can use the stock DET pistons to lower comp... is it needed or will it overheat with the wron compression and be shit...

 

I heard that a DE ECU can run with a turbo just without some of the usual sensors... can it be easily tunned or should i give up and stick to my original plans

 

Thanks Simon

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do a search :rolleyes:

 

yes and no, lots of things to do if you want to turbo a DE motor, so i'd say no coz it's easier/cheaper to buy a DET.

 

 

So true almost always works out cheaper to just buy a cadet and bolt it up

 

Cheers

 

anthony

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Lets say you had almost all the parts to use of the DET is it worth doing... I would use the DET Engine but i wanna save up for Forgies and rods before i do anything with that...

 

This is only a mean time thing on a $100 DE for my Bluebird... how can i lower the compression... will 2 gaskets work? Actually what is a decompression plate?

 

I have searched for ages but cant come across answers... thanks Simon

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do a search :rolleyes:

 

yes and no, lots of things to do if you want to turbo a DE motor, so i'd say no coz it's easier/cheaper to buy a DET.

this topic does come in very regularly. yes you can do it but at the expense of borrowed time (to see how much more life your engine will give you). no because a DE engine has a lot of differing parts when compared to a DET engine. really it will be more a pain to do this conversion. in all honesty it would be more feasible like what sini69 said above to just install a DET engine in there in the first place.

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hey, it might be more pheasible if to just do a complete engie swap, however if you do want to turbo a de it can be done and it can be reliable. ive got a s15de+t that is running fine. it all mainly comes down to the tune. im using a microtech and i run max 10 psi, but becausde of the higher comp, its like a det motor running 14psi

 

any help needed just meassage me

cheers

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Why anyone would bother buying a DE S15 is beyond me, if you got the money to buy an S15 why not just get a DET to start with?

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Yes sort of....its not as easy as that though.

 

We did it to my mates CA just recently.

 

It is actually easier to take the engine out to do the conversion, as it is is such a pain in the arse changing the N/A sump to a turbo sump inside the car :rolleyes: .

 

You also have to change the wiring loom over to turbo and the ECU. The car will still run on the NA wiring loom and ECU, but I wouldnt suggest it. Another friend of mine put a turbo motor in his car and ran it on the NA setup and it blew up running stock boost.

 

I would also suggest retarding the timming too! I wouldnt suggest running big boost through this setup though, stock boost is ok. Other than that it should be fine.

 

The NA exhaust will bolt up to the turbo dump pipe too ;) .

We found that the car came onto boost so fast (faster than the turbo engine).

 

List of things to do. (If you plan on leaving the engine inside the car).

 

You need to:

Drain the fluids (water and oil)

 

Take off the thermo fan.

Take out the Radiator.

Undo the extractors

Carefully take off the gasket (dont just rip the manifold and extractors off)

Undo the brackets for all the power steering and aircon (move them out of the way so you can get to the block off nut for the oil feed line).

Undo the bolt on the side of the block and swap it with the nipple for the oil feed line (you need this from a turbo car or get one from a enzed hoes or what ever).

Under the engine mounts

Jack up the engine

Undo the cross member

Undo the front sway bar

Undo the the sump (this is the hard part, whilst engine is still in the car is an absolute bitch).

Pull the sump out with great difficulty (manouver it carefully not to hurt the oil pickup and all that jaz that hangs down in the sump) DO NOT JUST YANK ON IT YOU WILL DAMAGE STUFF!!

Put the new sump in with all the gaskets clean and gasket goo on it. We used Sikaflex.

And do the reverse.

Bolt the Turbo and manifold on and hood up the oil and water lines.

Change the wiring loom

Change the ECU

Change the fuel pump (I heard they are different and I've also heard they are the same :S )

 

I hope I havent left anything out.

 

This took us 8 hours flat out with two of us and we both knew what we were doing. I wouldnt suggest a novice to do this conversion.

 

I would also suggest that it is easier with the engine out, but if that is the case you may aswell put a turbo motor in at the same time. You will require all the other turbo stuff like ecu and all that, so it its best to get all that you need first (lucky we had several blown turbo motors and spares when we did ours + my mate works at an import wreckers ;) ).

 

James

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Thanks 07XTC That will be handy to know, All the engines in my case are out and they aint going into a Silvia so i may as well attempt it....

 

With the loom and Ecu... Can I use a DE loom with the wires changed at the plug into a DET Ecu...?

 

That way atleast its got the mapping already for the turbo engines running... does the compresson or camshafts used matter with the Ecu's job? should i run DET cams..?

 

I have a DET resistor and diagrams so i should be able to get plugs from bosch for the DET injectors and wire that in... I dont mind using almost any parts i have cause the 1600 is a fair way off and i wanna put the hybrid in my Bluebird...

 

Thanks Simon

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I would suggest just using a full DET wiring loom and save all the hastles. You will need the boost cut thingy-ma-bob (sits near your air filter and has an extra part to the loom. Im not sure what its called because Im an RX7 owner not a silvia owner :P (although have helped out my mate on several occassions working on his silvia).

 

I have a mate that can probably get you a CA18DET loom and ecu if you like?

 

Personally I wouldnt bother chopping the loom etc its hastles. If anything I would suggest just getting a full after market ecu if you were planning on chopping the loom. I think even the apexi power fc still uses the factor boost cut thingy but it is reprogramed. The turbo ecu may not like it if you dont have all it needs. Plus it reads maps and adds fuel accordingly with the turbo injectors wich raises another point I forgot to mention earlier........you will also need to change injectors over as they are different, but if you are going to the trouble and you dont have CA18DET injectors I would suggest a set of GT-R 440cc injectors as they are a straight slot in (top feed) and they are the correct impedance/resistance for the CA18 motor. If you keep the N/A loom you will have to chop it in a number of places (injectors for DET type as the plugs are different, and ecu).

 

Also the cold start plug is different, it looks the same but it doesnt run right on the car (well this was the case with my mates car), or you can put up with it coughing and spluttering when its cold either way).

 

As for the cams I really wouldnt bother with them, if you have them then it may help. I have heard in some cases (you piston engine car owners) where you guys exchange the exhaust cam with an N/A cam because the duration is slightly longer and keeps the exhaust valve open for longer, hence creating more exhaust flow. But then I have heard from some people, that using an N/A exhaust cam with cause the turbo to over heat (which I think is a load of BS). Anyways up to you, I suggest get a more expert opinion ;)

 

 

Hope this helps out ;)

 

James

Edited by 07XTC

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Why do you need to change the sump exactly?

 

 

Because it has the oil return point for the turbo. Turbo cars use oil from the engine block to circulate through the turbo to lubricate the bearings/bushes and to aid in cooling and loss of latenent heat through conduction, where by heat from a hotter object (namely the bearings) and is passed onto the cooler object (the oil). No oil will cause the turbo to overheat very very quickly. So a turbo car will have a oil feed where the oil is pumped into the turbo and then after the hot oil has left the turbo it returns to the sump. In cars engines like rotaries where the exhaust gases are extremely hot and where exhaust flows are a lot more the bearings/bushes of the turbo will become a lot lot more hotter, so they have an oil cooler standard which is like a radiator for your oil. I believe that most piston cars dont have oil coolers standard. Heat intensity also breaks downs the bonds in oil and reduces the oils viscosity (spelling :S ) hence why turbo cars require oil changes more regularly.

 

What I have stated above is a very simplified version of what goes on; if any one would like to to further elaborate or correct me feel free ;)

 

You could drill a hole in the sump and weld an oil return line on but I highly recommend that you dont do this whilst the sump is attached to the block for several reasons, the main one being the risk of drill burs/metal shavings going into the sump area and f**king your motor later on. If you are desperate and dont have a turbo sump you could possibly do it very very carefully and flush the shit out of the engine with oil and hopefully all the shavings will disappear and then use a magnetic sump plug (but I would not suggest doing this as itis dodgy), it is easier just to change the sump over, especially in YBUYNEW's case where the engine is out of the car already. But if the engine is out, you can take the N/A sump off anyway and then drill it and weld on a connection. If the sump is off the engine it isnt dodgy provided that you test the seal on the weld to make sure it doesnt leak oil.

 

We recently took the twin turbo setup off a 2JZ GTE engine and converted it to single T51Z (huge single setup) and modifed the oil return line to the sump and it required welding and then pressure testing (we used a high power water hoes- water is still a liquid :D ). We must have re-welded the seal at least 20 times before it sealed correctly (and it was only an oil return line not a sump :rolleyes: ). So in saying this I reckon for all the bothering involved it is easier just to wack on a turbo sump ;).

I would recommend for anyone that does want to do this, that they clean all the oil out of the sump thoroughly as you might see you self going up in flames :woot: (and evaporate most of the water out in the end with an oxy if it is a rushed job, otherwise residual water in your oil may get in your oil).

 

Im sorry if my explanations are so elaborate and I hope you guys understand what Im on about. In my head I know what I'm talking about, just hope you guys do too.

Edited by 07XTC

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Edited by hezyqug

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