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s15Ferreira

330ci vs s15 - Fight!

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Hello s15 lovers!

 

First post (y) looking forward to the many to come.

 

I'm in the market for either a s15 or a specific BMW 330ci I've seen with 118k km's:

 

http://www.carsales....D-3235758/?Cr=7

 

I've read that the bimmer's can set people back about 1-2k a year just so maintain them, which isn't terribly bad and it is in my price range. But would an s15 be significantly cheaper? Is it even possible to find one that can be a decent buy for under 15k? What would be the very max amount of K's you'd accept if buying one.

 

I'm on my green P's still so I can drive the JDM one's yet. Here are some I was looking at:

 

http://www.carsales....D-3233990/?Cr=2

 

http://www.carsales....D-3161329/?Cr=3

 

http://www.carsales....D-3249222/?Cr=7

 

http://www.carsales....D-3101640/?Cr=8

 

http://www.carsales....-2874451/?Cr=13

 

The last two are quite interesting, last one has been rebuilt very recently, but who knows how many km's the chassis has done. The second last one really has my attention, I love black s15's, sweet interior and the rebuilt motor has done 120k k's.

 

Just looking for some thought and opinions from some of you more experienced guys.

 

Thanks guys

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Tho I loved having an import when I was 19, I'd probably just buy something cheap to start off with if I had to do it over.

 

Depends what you want out of life I suppose. Its a big purchase and its easy to convince yourself that you can afford it but do you have to pay rent and look after yourself? Insurance isn't cheap etc..

 

If you are cashed up tho I'd try and find a sub 100km unit, save cash til you get your opens and get a clean example.

 

I'd be suss on the rebuilt one.. Why wouldn't you just throw in another engine? Parts for BMW would be a PITA while support for s15 is all over the internet and eBay.

 

In the interest of not being an old man: go with what your heart desires, they are both nice cars and you'll have good times regardless.

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I think it really comes down to potential, servicing and parts.

 

The S15 will be less reliable than the BMW, for reasons of age and thrashing. Let's not kid ourselves here, because it's true. However, should anything fail on the S15, you can find another part for cheap; good luck doing the same thing with the BMW.

 

For instance, if you blow and engine with the S15, buy another used one for $2500, pay someone from NS several hundred for their assitance over a weekend and be on your way. Blow an engine on the BMW and your first thought is going to be "where the f**k do I find one?", then when you find one, you'll fall off your seat.

 

In saying that though, personally I would opt for something more fun like an S2000. You can find them in the same price range as the BMW, they look better than either car and... well just test drive one. It's a Honda so it's not a massive powerhouse, but they go alright and can have a turbo custom fitted if you feel the need later on.

 

I'll also point out that the BMW is ugly as hell, the interior SCREAMS 'whisky, cigarettes and old man farts', not to mention you'll end up having every drug-dealing Leb trying to buy the car off you each time you stop at a McDonalds carpark. Been there, done that lol.

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Apples and oranges.

 

I'd take the Beemer over some thrashed-out Jap car any day of the week.

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Tho I loved having an import when I was 19, I'd probably just buy something cheap to start off with if I had to do it over.

 

Depends what you want out of life I suppose. Its a big purchase and its easy to convince yourself that you can afford it but do you have to pay rent and look after yourself? Insurance isn't cheap etc..

 

If you are cashed up tho I'd try and find a sub 100km unit, save cash til you get your opens and get a clean example.

 

I'd be suss on the rebuilt one.. Why wouldn't you just throw in another engine? Parts for BMW would be a PITA while support for s15 is all over the internet and eBay.

 

In the interest of not being an old man: go with what your heart desires, they are both nice cars and you'll have good times regardless.

 

Thanks for the wise two cents. Don't worry I can definitely afford it :) - I'm not cashed up but my employer can't afford to lose me and they just won't want to let me go anyway, been there a while.

 

See saving up and buying a good example when I have my fulls would be a smart decision but I really would like something a bit more fun than a 1.8 n/a lancer for the next 1.5 years.

 

Could someone please elaborate as to why I should avoid cars with rebuilt engines? To my knowledge a car with a rebuilt engine shouldn't have any engine problems for as long as a new engine right? Therefore the engine would be just as reliable as new but the chassis would be more troublesome?

 

Thanks for all your replies :)

 

S15 because you're young, for me I'll take the BMW smile.png

haha they're both fun and excellent handling cars :P I've driven an autech model s15 and a normal 330ci and I just loved them both a lot. Probably the 330 more actually but like what the bloke said below me, scared of things which would potentially go wrong. $$$

 

I think it really comes down to potential, servicing and parts.

 

The S15 will be less reliable than the BMW, for reasons of age and thrashing. Let's not kid ourselves here, because it's true. However, should anything fail on the S15, you can find another part for cheap; good luck doing the same thing with the BMW.

 

For instance, if you blow and engine with the S15, buy another used one for $2500, pay someone from NS several hundred for their assitance over a weekend and be on your way. Blow an engine on the BMW and your first thought is going to be "where the f**k do I find one?", then when you find one, you'll fall off your seat.

 

In saying that though, personally I would opt for something more fun like an S2000. You can find them in the same price range as the BMW, they look better than either car and... well just test drive one. It's a Honda so it's not a massive powerhouse, but they go alright and can have a turbo custom fitted if you feel the need later on.

 

I'll also point out that the BMW is ugly as hell, the interior SCREAMS 'whisky, cigarettes and old man farts', not to mention you'll end up having every drug-dealing Leb trying to buy the car off you each time you stop at a McDonalds carpark. Been there, done that lol.

 

Bahaha but any car would scream farts and maybe cigs, sure hope I don't hear any cries of any alco though :P

 

Do you have any clue what some of the most costly repairs of an s15 would be? Like let's say I buy one that hasn't be slaughtered but isn't exactly pristine, what would I expect to pay in repairs over say a couple years?

 

I can imagine an s2k would be an awesome awesome drive but I need a couple back seats at least :(

 

I love the look of the 330ci with an m3 bumper and csl wheels - yummy.

 

You said you've been there done that, with an e46? How much did you pay on repairs over how long if so?

 

BIG thanks guys

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Apples and oranges.

 

I'd take the Beemer over some thrashed-out Jap car any day of the week.

 

I do like the 330 more I think but I'm worried about it potentially being a money pit

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Why don't you ring up some suppliers and price some spares such as brake pads, rotors, clutches etc for both cars to give you a better idea on running costs

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European cars are typically cluster f**ks with maintenance, especially electrics. They are on average more expensive, more difficult to repair DIY, and less reliable.

 

the SR20/S15 reliability/ease of maintenance is going to depend largely on the previous owners attitude. Besides that they are fairly solid, easy to work on, wide source of local knowledge, plenty of after market parts for the budget minded DIYer, and respond well to mods.

Edited by Varvs

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Here's a solution, buy a C63 AMG :)

 

That's my solution to most car woes lol

 

You and C63's...

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I've had both S15 and currently 323i. Both depend on how they've been looked after previously. Didn't have too many issues with the S15, even when it was pushing ~350rwkw. Had a lot of issues with the BMW, ranging from electrics to cooling system. Although most issues were to do with derelict previous owner. Can't comment on relative cost because I'm not in Australia atm, the the BMW is cheaper here. The only thing I'd say is the BMW feels more robust, but the S15 was much more fun to drive

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I agree that in general Jap cars are easier to work on than European cars. I've also noticed I see more broken down BMW's at the side of the road than any other make, maybe they are suited to our climate?

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Thanks a lot for the replies everyone. Definitely leaning towards the s15 now, I just a couple of stories of people buying 330ci's with relatively low k's and with the car looking in decent nick yet problems arised in no time and they had to spend ALOT.

 

I really do love the look of s15's and a lot of the appeal is that they're "fairly solid, easy to work on, wide source of local knowledge, plenty of after market parts for the budget minded DIYer" - thanks varvs.

 

Tom Tucker - My god that's a lot of power. Glad to know your car could handle it for a while.

 

I'm having a bit of a dilemma though, I'm looking through carsales and on forums for sale sections and I have two options, get a relatively stock s15 which I can legally drive on P's or buy something like a bugeye wrx or DC5r (both p plate legal) and then sell to buy a well modded s15 with higher kw when I have my fulls down the road.

 

Opinions?

 

How much would someone typically spend to achieve say 250-200kw on an s15?

 

Thanks heaps every one

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How much would someone typically spend to achieve say 250-200kw on an s15?

 

Thanks heaps every one

 

Hypergear turbo ~$1300 inculding lines

Chinese FMIC kit ~$250

Nistune Type 4 board ~ $340 fitted locally

740cc injectors ~$700 installed

Dyno Tune ~$700

Z32 AFM ~$250 installed with bits

Walbro fuel pump ~$200

Rocker Arm Stoppers $50 diy install

Baffled Oil Pan ~$100 diy install

 

 

Now that's for brand new parts, so the price drops when you can score used parts in good condition for a low price.

 

Personally, I think you'll find it cheaper to buy a clean modded example, then roll the ECU, turbo and intercooler back to stock. Stock T28 turbos are quite inexpensive, used ECUs are well under $300 from private sellers, and few people want the stock intercooler or AFM. When you're on your fulls, you can literally just bolt the aftermarket parts back where they were, and it will be as you bought it. If you install those four stock parts, the car will run like stock, since it will have the oem tune and turbo. The intercooler change is simply due to the RTA being wankers; it shouldn't even be on their "no mods brah" list to be perfectly frank.

 

It might sound daunting but the job is one that noobs can achieve with some care, a little time and minimal tools. I say that in the context of my first DIY mechanical task was to change the clutch in my old Corolla a long time agao using a Haynes manual, dodgy Chinese socket set, scissors jacks and bricks. No forums, no Youtube, no cell phones. A turbo swap is much easier than that.

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Not to mention if you're really floundering with it, there would be a bunch of guys that would likely be happy to help you out for a couple hundred bucks. I can recommend at least one depending on your area.

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250kw sucks. If you want real fasts, go for 200kw:

 

fmic

3" exhaust

boost controller

nistune

 

keep the 6 speed, and change to a 3.9 or 4.1 diff. Car will be very fasts.

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Im rocking 187KW at the wheels and its definitely enough.

 

200 would be my ceiling before the car would become too much to drive spiritedly.

 

FMIC

T28 @ 21PSI

Apex filter/metal intake/pod box

480CC injectors

electronic boost controller

DW300 fuel pump

Nistune

 

Thats on a non-VCT Sr20, so I would imagine you are going to get closer to 200kw than I would.

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better yet find a semi-modded S15, then just throw a bigger turbo, injectors, E85, ECU and pump out close to 300kW.. but at the same time limit boost till after 4800rpm so you don't smash the box...

 

ideally set boost by gear & rpm :)

 

Oh yeah, I can dyno tune & I have access to a Mainline dyno for less than what a shop charges.

 

 

If you need small mechanical stuff done, I'm happy to help.. not much of a fan on the larger jobs anymore as I've moved to a small townhouse and don't have the luxury of a double garage & carport :(

 

(yes this is why I've been emo about my car and trying to sell it.. what's the point of having a car when you can't play with it) LOL

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For age is do 15. Your young so be young. Get a beema when ta older when u can appreciate something slower and comfy. You like once so get that fun noisey s15 cause u can't get one when ta old. My s15 has copped a hiding yes it's broken because I drive like an idiot but with the help from the forums it's not a problem when or if it plays up. Just listen to the older guys for advice! 330 bmw will have heaps of electrical faults and as mentioned will be crazy expensive to resolve. S15 hands down

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As everyone has said, both cars aren't going to be reliable. Do you have a job?

 

You might get lucky and buy a gem but my guess is you'll have your hand in your pocket all the time with the s15 (I know, I owned one), and the beemer you'll probably have a better run but then no one will know how to fix the electrics when they start playing up and you'll get drilled paying for parts.

 

I reckon get a newer jap car with lower k's, it may cost a bit more up front but you'll probably save a bundle in the long run. If you have to go performance, you might like an MPS.

 

http://www.carsales.com.au/private/details/Mazda-3-2008/SSE-AD-3185216/?Cr=4

 

Not as pretty as the s15, and you'll never be a drift hero but you'll be able to get in the car, turn the key and drive and not worry about all the other bullshit.

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Err... looks like a housewives car, not as easy to work on as an S15, 6 airbags to replace, front wheel drive, and Mazda aren't exactly known for being dirt cheap on prices or servicing. Might as well suggest he buy a Corolla, because that's 90% of what an MPS is.

 

I know where you're coming from Spazo, but the MPS is clearly not the class of vehicle he's looking for, and having been in an MPS being thrashed... bit of a yawn-fest to be perfectly honest.

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S15 is the go. Trick is finding one that's been looked after and not ruined by some flat brimmer. Take your time to look around and find the right one. Buy from someone who's a bit older, has the money to have maintained it and if you're lucky you might find one already modified tastefully to save you some money

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I want the same question asked in a BMW forum to see the response and justification from the dark side...

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Err... looks like a housewives car, not as easy to work on as an S15, 6 airbags to replace, front wheel drive, and Mazda aren't exactly known for being dirt cheap on prices or servicing. Might as well suggest he buy a Corolla, because that's 90% of what an MPS is.

 

I know where you're coming from Spazo, but the MPS is clearly not the class of vehicle he's looking for, and having been in an MPS being thrashed... bit of a yawn-fest to be perfectly honest.

 

250HP in FWD is like having 200HP in an FWD and an extra 50 that gets lost somewhere in the wheel spin.

 

S15 is the go. Trick is finding one that's been looked after and not ruined by some flat brimmer. Take your time to look around and find the right one. Buy from someone who's a bit older, has the money to have maintained it and if you're lucky you might find one already modified tastefully to save you some money

 

 

Flat brimmers own R31s or KE70s (which is next-level trashedness)

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I want the same question asked in a BMW forum to see the response and justification from the dark side...

 

Probably get a combination of roid junkies telling you that "BMWs iz sik brah uz get won brah an bitchz will root uz all day brah", and various old blokes insisting that they can still get it up without pills.

 

Jokes aside, BMW do make some great cars and solid engines, but the hard facts cannot be changed no matter how much a forum fanboys it; this is the wrong country to be owning a BMW. They're known to have reliability issues when driven *normally*, parts are expensive, knowledge is limited compared to Jap cars,the entire car is exceptionally overpriced compared to Europe and f**king torx bolts.

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S15 is the go. Trick is finding one that's been looked after and not ruined by some flat brimmer. Take your time to look around and find the right one. Buy from someone who's a bit older, has the money to have maintained it and if you're lucky you might find one already modified tastefully to save you some money

 

Are u talking about me? I'm thinking of selling mine lol. Im old and over maintain it ahah

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S15 is the go. Trick is finding one that's been looked after and not ruined by some flat brimmer. Take your time to look around and find the right one. Buy from someone who's a bit older, has the money to have maintained it and if you're lucky you might find one already modified tastefully to save you some money

 

Are u talking about me? I'm thinking of selling mine lol. Im old and over maintain it ahah

 

C63 time! woooooooooooo

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Hahah I bought a Range Rover john! No c63 for me. The surfboard won't go in one of those things and it's not quite my thing. They are awersome though!

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I need a new car :(

 

The R33 just doesn't do it for me anymore.. the odd gate here and there and the odd track day is good.. if only 3x cars were an option LOL

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