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retailers form yet another lobby group to push for increased taxes on on-line goods.

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Retailers form new lobby group

 

 

 

AUSTRALIAN retailers may be doing it hard, but they are fighting back with a new industry group designed to lobby governments on a range of issues affecting the struggling sector.

The Australian Traders Group (ATG) will be launched in Melbourne on Friday with the purpose of lobbying governments on issues such as the reduction of the low value imports threshold for GST, the importation of counterfeit products, penalty rates and rent agreements.

 

 

http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/national/festive-spend-could-be-best-in-three-years/story-e6frfku9-1226535752591

 

So here we go again, big retailers who refuse to modernize blaming the internet for all there woes are going to be throwing tons of money at our political parties to try and pass laws that will drag us back into the dark ages so that they can continue price gouging customers while delivering terrible customer service....

 

Its shit like this that makes me feel a whole lot less guilty about writing a piece of code that could put businesses like these out of business some day. They fvcking deserve it.

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I don't think people realize how large the retail sector is and what the multiplier effect will look like on the rest of the economy should it collapse

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Why should I pay top dollar for something as simple as a shirt when I can get one for up to 70% of the price online?

 

People like this f**k Australia up. Keep increasing prices, tax everything, and you wonder why people are struggling.

Things like furniture, smokes, bills, internet etc are stupidly priced or taxed in Aus.

 

Don't forget things like food and drinks. I only shop at Aldi. Quality still there at a fraction of the price.

 

Oh and 90% are made or assembled in China.

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Retailers should lobby for lower import duties and taxes, the reason why prices are so high here in Australia in the first place and why everyone buys online. Then I might start buying more at the shops.

Edited by Rocky88

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I don't think people realize how large the retail sector is and what the multiplier effect will look like on the rest of the economy should it collapse

 

It's funny that people are happy to adopt the saying, adapt or die mentality when it comes to humans...

 

The retail sector are just shifting blame. If a restaurant becomes outdated in it's style, deliver under par food and poor service, the restaurant would only have itself to blame. These examples can been seen on TV in other countries with Heston, Ramsay ect... Why should retail be treated any different.

 

With the advent of the internet, people become much more aware of prices overseas. Prior to this it was people whom went away on holidays that would tout how cheap food and clothes, but was more seen as a bonus since you still had to buy an expensive flight ticket to go shop at those places. In part, the game industry had adapted by offering both buy in store or online.

 

Sure there are some overheads that can't be avoided, some freight costs as well... However These costs when shared over all the products don't add up to some of the HUGE markups.

 

But the number one thing that any successful business already knows... but many, so so many get wrong, is exemplary customer service. Having worked in a company where customer service is key to maintaining and growing long term customers, such a simple thing can make all the difference between a pissed off customer and a good natured customer when things go wrong.

 

Retail need to change their ways and offer something you can't get as easily online.

  • Sales people who know more about the products then whats written on the box
  • Sales people who have had personal experience with the products
  • Have stock of the products, If I have to wait, I may as well get it cheaper online and get it delivered to my door (work/home)
  • Be up to date with current products and technology. Being an industry leader in both knowledge and product means you keep ahead of the competition and earn the respect of your customers.

The shops the are successful will be the ones whom adapt and change based on the climate. Not those who wine about "poor me, my customers are leaving me because I over charge and don't treat them very well, better get the government to change the rules because I can't be bothered to change"

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The thing that is really annoying is that half the time its not even price that is the deciding factor in most peoples choice to buy on-line. It's things like convenience, range and quite often better customer service. Its quite often just a better customer experience.

 

I don't think people realize how large the retail sector is and what the multiplier effect will look like on the rest of the economy should it collapse

 

But it won't collapse, we'll just see a changing of the guard. while franchises like harvey norman and myer may collapse, new and more efficient modern retail brands will start to appear. not to mention increases in industries such as warehousing, transport/logistics, marketing/advertising etc as well as new opportunities that will come into fruition for innovative entrepreneurs who are smart enough to take advantage of the benefits of automation and outsourcing and the much lower start-up and operating costs that come with it. All of a sudden business that would not have been viable just 10 years ago will now have a chance to thrive.

 

examples of this can be seen in the tech industry where advances in things like high level programming languages/frameworks and the introduction of things like IAAS services (cloud hosting), have reduced the costs so much that a tech start up that here 10 years ago would have cost well over half a million dollars just to get it off the ground can now get up and running for under 50 grand. This has led to an explosion in the tech industry.

 

Australian companies need to stop trying to implement all these stupid protectionist laws and dragging us back into the 1950's and start thinking about how to operate in a global economy and taking advantage of all the opportunities that come with it for the savvy player.

Edited by sweepa

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I buy the majority of my goods from China, through eBay.

Why? Because if I buy them in a retail store, they're still coming from China, but I'm paying the middle-man some 2000% mark-up at times. I've gotten leather wallets for $8. Does that not get anybody in the retail-sector thinking?

 

The problem is, things are so expensive in Australia. I know it's supposed to be this huge idea of our higher minimum wage and all, but why is it that an iPhone 5 costs some $400 - $500 more on Australian soil, just because... well, it's been sold in Australia? Surely it wouldn't cost about 200% of the iPhone 5 in America, because of "higher minimum wages".

This, to me, is just the retail sector trying to find blame for their downwards slope. Don't get me wrong, I do still buy a lot of stuff locally, but these days I'm swinging more towards buying produce from farmers, and clothes/items from markets. Things are just way too expensive in the retail-sector.

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Its completely obvious why the cost of retail products is more than online

 

- Rent

- Staff

- Inventory

 

I have no problem with the fact that the things are easier and cheaper to buy online. But which of the above do the bricks and mortar slash to remain competitive and what industries does that have a flow on effect for? Margins are high to cover these

 

Rent - property market dies even more in the arse, real estate agents and construction industry and relegated to residential. Downsizing of these industries

 

Staff- what job are the uni students and and high school students going to go into while putting themselves through higher education? Possible slow down of higher education sector and overall education level in Australia meaning less competitive on the global scale. What do we do with the unskilled workforce that cant get a job on the retail floor? Higher unemployment rate and increase in tax's to compensate.

 

Inventory - Logistic companies down the gurgler. Yes some of this can be taken up in the fact that AusPost will be run of its feet trying to deliver the product to the individual customer. Warehousing need decrease (see rent), reduction in range and supply rate, downward spiral.

 

The number of Aussie companies will shrink as our dollar goes overseas to grow their business. Management positions are few and far between, less to share in the money-go-round, the price of luxury imported goods goes up as a result of decrease in demand meaning higher shipping and supply rates.

 

Service industry boom as people realise this is the only industry that cant be exported, huge jump in competition reducing prices to unsustainable margins, only way to remain competitive is join forces to increase service levels and support power, creation of monopoly.

 

China's cost of production goes up as it become more westernised, production moves to other 3rd world country. Huge amount of unskilled laborers in China, unsustainable economy - collapse of the largest economy in the world. Share market crash, global recession, food stamps

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Its completely obvious why the cost of retail products is more than online

 

- Rent

- Staff

- Inventory

 

Bullshit.

 

There is no amount of costs that can explain the 50-100% disparity in pricing between retail and online.

Many of the overseas stores have their own shop front to maintain.

 

The main price hike happens before retailers even get their hands on the goods. The suppliers are the ones price gouging us, and the only way they will ever change their ways is if people stop buying their stupidly priced products.

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the fact is, the benefits to buying in store are dying, even if it wasn't for the alternative, people would still be as unhappy with the retail service that we get today. going in store you're dealing with inferior product knowledge and service that what you can get online, let alone how much cheaper it is. seriously, i go into retail stores these days and i will rarely bother asking someone in store their opinion as generally they are under-knowledged wankers who make dealing with them a chore.

 

big corporations pushed out the smaller businesses by providing cheap prices at the sacrifice of quality and service, the retail experience suffered even if it became cheaper, the small businesses that made the retail experience enjoyable are almost gone, but without another alternative people continued to shop there. now that there is an alternative the big retail corporations are getting pissy because the online shops are doing exactly what the retail corporations did years ago and provide yet again cheaper products at the expense of service.

 

From an economical stand point, maybe our sympathy is justified, i don't know, i'm not an economist, from an ethical perspective i feel bad for the small businesses once again, however for the corporations who are mostly behind these movements, they can quite frankly blow my penis.

Edited by nisskid

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Rent - property market dies even more in the arse, real estate agents and construction industry and relegated to residential. Downsizing of these industries

 

To be honest I have no problem with this. The property market is overblown and like everything else in Australia is overpriced. I'm amazed it's made it this far. Where the f**k did the baby boomers generation think this was going to go when they were all buying houses for cheap and then selling them for way more later. That somehow eventually the next generations were going to come along and pay triple the amounts they paid. We are paying a 100 percent increase on what houses were in the 1970s and 80s when adjusted for increased quality of housing, changes in the consumer prices and economic growth.

 

For most of the members here our parents and their generation f**ked it all up and tried to make shitloads of money by overvaluing houses and now everyone gets all whiny and cracks the shits when it turns out that property isn't worth that much because the only ones who can afford it are the generation that made money by overvaluing it.

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Import taxes etc and RRP put on products by the big companies for different countries shit me. Good example is getting a new set of runners

Asis shoes GT2000

Retail in USA $120

Retail in AUS $189

 

Same pair of shoes, same manufacturer and both coming from the same place strangely enough. The retail outlets in AUS dont even carry my size or width and wont order it in unless i pay upfront and wait for their next shipment.

Or

I buy online from the USA, pay $20 postage and have it here quicker and $49 cheaper.

 

What option would you take?

 

Everything I buy I go online for apart from food where I can. Its amazing how much better service and if I call the place up how much more information I get from them about it by a simple call over walking into a shop here getting told utter BS and leaving unhappy after spending $10 on parking in the city to have a shit crowded experience.

Plus frieght from China etc to SA is quicker than it is from QLD to SA, GO FIGURE!

Edited by r31silo

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Staff- what job are the uni students and and high school students going to go into while putting themselves through higher education? Possible slow down of higher education sector and overall education level in Australia meaning less competitive on the global scale. What do we do with the unskilled workforce that cant get a job on the retail floor? Higher unemployment rate and increase in tax's to compensate.

 

A lot will probably move into courier driving, or any businesses that act as a small physical display front to a direct-delivery online store.

Service-oriented businesses would also increase, so probably something new in that field too, such as technical/software/security repair and tuition for noobs. New business ventures appear, to match new demands.

 

Inventory - Logistic companies down the gurgler. Yes some of this can be taken up in the fact that AusPost will be run of its feet trying to deliver the product to the individual customer. Warehousing need decrease (see rent), reduction in range and supply rate, downward spiral.

 

Retail transport is just one section of logistics. There's a whole lot moving around beyond just TVs and dresses. When you consider all the construction material, equipment, produce, ore, etc, all you'll be doing is switching focus from moving boxes to Target, to moving boxes from the Airport or Docks to Joe Average.

You'll probably find that more cash will be invested into creating new ports, as well as facilitating extraction. Courier businesses would also pop up more and more as demand increases, leading to additional cash pumped into road maintenance and construction, not to mention Customs at the airport.

 

The number of Aussie companies will shrink as our dollar goes overseas to grow their business. Management positions are few and far between, less to share in the money-go-round, the price of luxury imported goods goes up as a result of decrease in demand meaning higher shipping and supply rates.

 

Versus luxury goods already being heavily taxed and sold at retail outlets for $$$, not to mention the lack of Aussie manufacturers due to most retail goods already being sourced from overseas. Any impact of cash leaving our economy is already occurring to the same degree, so the retail issue is primarily related to job loss, or reduced government income from goods taxation. Cash people saved on their purchases is likely to be spent elsewhere, so the house will still win. As for job loss - perhaps people will have cash to spend in other areas, to which the newly unemployed retail peeps can migrate.

 

Service industry boom as people realise this is the only industry that cant be exported, huge jump in competition reducing prices to unsustainable margins, only way to remain competitive is join forces to increase service levels and support power, creation of monopoly.

 

Fantastic. Australia is running low on skilled trades people, and as a result all the plumbers/sparkies/labourers overcharge a sh*tload more than they should. $80 call-out fee on a plumber? Get the f**k out of here. When you look at their average site journey time and qualifications, it's a joke. 3 year apprenticeship only taking home $200 per week? Boo hoo. 3 years at uni clocking up the same hours, earning 0 dollars and instead accruing a debt, then graduating into much lower paid roles for a few years.

 

China's cost of production goes up as it become more westernised, production moves to other 3rd world country. Huge amount of unskilled laborers in China, unsustainable economy - collapse of the largest economy in the world. Share market crash, global recession, food stamps

 

Not our problem. First, if anyone is going to f**k the Chinese economy, it's China's government, and they're doing a damn good job of it. We shouldn't feel badly in the slightest if our tiny contribution to their coffers adds to the burden. Second, China tends to be investor, rather than investee. They go bust and want to sell assets, those assets will likely be bought back at a lower cost.

Edited by pmod

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how big do they want this tax to be, the last number thrown around was 10% to match the gst...i think its ridiculous that the big shops like harvey norman think that applying one little tax is going to have us all delete our ebay accounts and go brick and mortar only the supposed tax's and markup applied to most items in stores of aus would still price items well above what internet stores+10% can offer not to mention the connivence and so off internet shopping

 

its been said but the price isnt the only factor, its a massive one, but not the only one, convenience is the biggest for me, i can shop online for say a laptop i can see whats on offer then i can research the shit out of each product, find the best suited one then compare prices amongst any number of stores, with ratings for said stores built in usually, pick the best one again and click buy, it will turn up in a few days, job done 24/7, doing the same in brick and mortar requires a full day of going from shop to shop and either taking tiny little bulletpoint placards or dipshit sales people on their word or standing in each store with the phone out internet comparing, then being at the mercy of what stock is available all within the 9-5, such a freaking hassle.

 

the only time i go into brick and mortar now really is when ive done the internet bit and found that through some miracle a physical store has a better offer, the hassle is reduced to drive in walk directly to item without making eye contact with any sales people lest an upsell ship attacks buy the item and head home even that adds the hassle of parking and traffic.

 

 

 

now that i think about it im pretty sure some of this argument for the tax is that even the forward thinking companies who have built online infrastructures are suffering because being australian businesses they still have to pay tax where external ones dont, that does change the way i look at the argument but still, get a lawyer to drum up a foolproof offshore setup works for apple and google, mostly

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Last time I went to Myer (Giftcard - no choice), I had to get the attention of two dumb blondes who were talking about their weekend until they served me - never going back there.

 

At David Jones - $260 for 1000TC Sherriden sheets, told them too expensive, they followed after me, begging me to buy it at a cheaper price.

 

f**k retail. It only really exists for women who have nothing to do but spend their partner's money (or metro fags with nothing better to do).

 

That's what it's really about. I Went there.

 

Also with Westfield now making paid parking mandatory next year and public transport still being a bag of dicks....

 

Maybe a better question is, "Do we need retail?" - Rather than trying to save a sinking ship.

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Meh I have no loyalty to these big brand shops. You don't get as huge as these retailers are without a fkning collossal profit.

 

I'm going to continue buying online, also on the topic of helpfulness/politeness I find asian sellers on ebay for example to be super nice and helpful compared to some shops here where for example the other night the girl looked annoyed at me for making her have to get off her phone and called someone else to help me.

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Local retailers dominate online shopping searches in 2012

 

 

AUSTRALIAN retailers may be missing out on sales because of faulty websites and poor service, not competition from overseas retailers, experts say.

Big Australian retailers are ramping up their pressure on the government to lower the GST threshold on overseas imports to combat the "unfair disadvantage" they face from overseas stores.

But statistics released today by Google show major Australian retailers dominated the list of most searched shopping brands in 2012.

eBay was the most searched, followed by Woolworths, Big W, Coles, Harvey Norman, Kmart and Target.

 

 

Read more: http://www.news.com.au/business/companies/local-retailers-dominate-online-shopping-searches-in-2012/story-fnda1bsz-1226536956082#ixzz2F0C4Dg8K

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I dont hink you guys realise what it costs to run a shop as apposed to an online shop.

a shop can cost you thousands to run a week, a online shop from your mums basement is free maybe 50 bucks for domain name and hosting a month

they can afford to sell shirts for 2 bucks profit each one cause they will sell hundreds, a shop needs to make 10-20 bucks off a shirt to cover costs.

if you have never been in charge of a shop then you have no idea what your talking about with comments like "why should i buy from a shop for 50% more when online is cheaper"

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So rather than bleat about their customer base not supporting them thanks to being too expensive compared to the alternatives, why don't shopkeepers form a lobby group and try have taxes reduced? We pay too much because you (collective) pay too much in taxes on materials, etc.

 

Retailers are not the greedy thieving *milkshakes* in all this, the govt is and that needs to be addressed if shopkeepers wish to remain in business. Customers always have and always will look for the best deals, if the same thing is available elsewhere at a cheaper price and is more convenient to order online then bad luck, thems the breaks of running a business in an over taxed country where everything costs too much as a result.

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Wow, how many times have we had this debate? Slow news day me thinks.

 

The internet has taken its slice from just about every market (music, clothing, appliances etc) it's never going to be the same for artists and shop front owners. I don't think shop fronts will die out completely but it's only human to want things as cheaply as they can get them so it's survival of the fittest. The way we shop is changing, and if I owned a shop I'd be clutching at straws too. Not to say all industries/segments will suffer... services that require skilled workmen for example are much safer.

 

Anyway I often wonder how some of these shops even turn a profit with 5 staff standing around shooting the breeze and 1-2 customers just browsing. Estimate the overheads and the cost of staff and you begin to see why everything's marked up so much. Is it wasteful? Probably, but at least money is changing hands and people have jobs. I'm not so interested in giving my money to the jews at the top of the food chain, the building owners who charge too much ('cos they can), get way overpaid and live the high life at someone elses expense. And I'll echo the shitty customer service thing... so many f**king idiots working behind counters. I am pretty fussy and can get specific when I buy things, so assume they're dumb and get them to repeat my order almost every time.

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if you have never been in charge of a shop then you have no idea what your talking about with comments like "why should i buy from a shop for 50% more when online is cheaper"

who the f**k are you to tell me that I should buy from you, "because i run a shop and it costs more"????? I'm a CUSTOMER. Your job is to SELL to me. "Waah waah, it costs to much to run a shop, buy from me in sympahty" is about the most stupid, bullshit reason to buy from a seller ever. It plainly and simply tells me that you're far too lazy to offer customers a reason to buy from you and based purely on that notion, the rest of your service is probably going to be just about as lazy.

 

If you have have cared to read ANY reply in this thread, you would have seen that everyone knows that it costs significantly more to run a shop compared to selling online. you would have also seen that some people are willing to pay the difference, IF the shop offers them something that the online version doesn't.

 

Bitching and moaning about this is like deciding tomorrow you're going to start manufacturing carbies, when the rest of us have moved to efi 20 years go. Welcome to the nature of capitalism. I somehow doubt you'd buy your stock from the most expensive seller around "because you felt sorry for them" so why the f**k would we?

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^Couldn't have said it better Pyro!!!!!!

 

I hit the party and they stop in that mudda fucha

They be like, "Oh, that Gucci - that's hella tight."

I'm like, "Yo - that's fifty dollars for a T-shirt."

Limited edition, let's do some simple addition

Fifty dollars for a T-shirt - that's just some ignorant bitch (shit)

I call that getting swindled and pimped (shit)

I call that getting tricked by a business

That shirt's hella dough

And having the same one as six other people in this club is a hella don't

 

Admittedly, I do shop at salvos. They have the best shit, the best price and some dope shoes, jeans etc. That I can't find elsewhere.

No I don't buy any indie shit.

Edited by Rolled Cambers

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What other service can you offer in a clothing store? Keeping in mind money is tight because the operating margin is low as f**k.

 

There is no competitive advantage on some goods, most retail is just whats in stock at the right price. People talk of service, but the idea of service is having someone there behind the counter smiling - what else can we expect. Ive been to plenty of stores where the service at least equals that of shopping online (nothing)

 

Bricks and mortar have nothing to offer. The cost associated with running is huge so they will always lose on price. The service isnt there as they dont have money to pay staff so they take unskilled retards who just have to work as part of the dole scheme, inventory will be next to nill as they dont have the cash to spend on holding stock that doesnt sell.

 

Not disagreeing with anyone's posts in here, just going to be shocking when a huge chunk of the market changes - while the consumer wins i don't think the economy will

 

Interesting post above about courier companies popping up. could be a real growth industry, just hope it doesnt turn into a duopoly like our current grocery market. I wonder if a massive courier industry will take the place of the retail market?

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I remember one day looking at drawing tablets for my PC. I spent a good hour and a bit going around looking for them, before buying from Harvey Norman. I got a lesser-model, and paid a lot more for it, and it was the only option ANY stores had around me.

Why should I bother with retail when it can take so long to find (or possibly even not find) the item I'm after?

 

There's too many reasons why online shopping is growing in popularity.

 

- Easier to do at home, while half naked.

- Don't have to worry about people being judgemental on what you're purchasing.

- Don't have to worry about a lack of service.

- Can find the information about the products just as quickly as you can the item itself. Can't say the same about retail.

- Cheaper.

 

I've shopped at PCCaseGear a fair bit when building a computer.

Their prices are cheaper, I get the items within 24 hours (with their express postage option, which turns out cheaper than using AusPost), and I've had nothing but good experience with them. I've had so many unhelpful people in retail though. You guys ever been in Myers lately? There's so many sections, and no one walking around willing to answer questions.

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Why did Pizza prices shoot up?

It's between 10-15 a pizza in most shops. Luckily for me I get a large for 5.90. Shits on the over priced crap too.

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I get a large for $5.90 too.

Just gotta go to the family run businesses. You give more money to families, and you (mostly) get a better quality pizza in the process.

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What other service can you offer in a clothing store? Keeping in mind money is tight because the operating margin is low as f**k. There is no competitive advantage on some goods, most retail is just whats in stock at the right price. People talk of service, but the idea of service is having someone there behind the counter smiling - what else can we expect. Ive been to plenty of stores where the service at least equals that of shopping online (nothing) Bricks and mortar have nothing to offer. The cost associated with running is huge so they will always lose on price. The service isnt there as they dont have money to pay staff so they take unskilled retards who just have to work as part of the dole scheme, inventory will be next to nill as they dont have the cash to spend on holding stock that doesnt sell. Not disagreeing with anyone's posts in here, just going to be shocking when a huge chunk of the market changes - while the consumer wins i don't think the economy will Interesting post above about courier companies popping up. could be a real growth industry, just hope it doesnt turn into a duopoly like our current grocery market. I wonder if a massive courier industry will take the place of the retail market?

 

Help to choose size, understand cuts and body shapes, understand colours and skin tones, accessories that compliment rather then upsell, Know how much stock of X they have and in what size, or can find out quickly. Know when more stock is arriving, or what associated shops have stock if your out.

 

Other skills that are lacking, learn how to understand when people want help and when people want to be left alone.

 

that is a shit load that can be learnt quickly by people who have half a brain!

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I get a large for $5.90 too.

Just gotta go to the family run businesses. You give more money to families, and you (mostly) get a better quality pizza in the process.

 

Most shops are family run anyways (Not big ones like dominoes, pizza hut etc) and they are charging $10 for a large, that's under sized!

 

I understand when you go to the beach as rent is through the roof but other suburbs why?

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